---
title: 1 Kings 12:8 (JPS 1917) — But he forsook the counsel of the old men which they had given him,… · tree and pragmatics
description: But he forsook the counsel of the old men which they had given him, and took counsel with the young men that were grown up with him, that stood before him. Who acts: father, men, young men. 1 Kings 12:8 in JPS 1917 with its dependency tree and the pragmatics of every clause.
---

<!-- md -->
[Mova](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/) · [this page in HTML](https://mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/jps/1KI.459/)

<!-- crumbs -->
[home](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/) / [corpora](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/) / [Tanakh](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/tanakh/) / [Nevi'im](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/) / [1 Kings](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/1KI/) / [chapter 12](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/1KI/12/) / [12:8](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/1KI.12.8/) / JPS 1

# 1 Kings 12:8 · JPS 1917

<!-- .ven lang=en -->
But he forsook the counsel of the old men which they had given him, and took counsel with the young men that were grown up with him, that stood before him.

<!-- .vintro -->
**Who acts:** father, men, young men · **What happens:** forsake, give, take, grow up, stand · **To what, where:** counsel, old men, father, young men

<!-- .vabout -->
This is 1 Kings 12:8 · JPS 1917 in the English of the Jewish Publication Society's 1917 translation, from Mova's open Bible corpus. The page gives the sentence's syntax tree — a dependency tree in the style of Universal Dependencies, parsed by Mova and checked by a teacher model — and its pragmatics clause by clause: who acts (father, men, young men), what happens, when and where, as Mova's frames read it. The original of the verse links back to its own tree and to the Targum.

## The tree {#tree}

```conllu
# sent_id = jps:1KI:459
# text = But he forsook the counsel of the old men which they had given him, and took counsel with the young men that were grown up with him, that stood before him.
1	But	but	CCONJ	CC	_	3	cc	_	_
2	he	he	PRON	PRP	Case=Nom|Gender=Masc|Number=Sing|Person=3|PronType=Prs	3	nsubj	_	_
3	forsook	forsake	VERB	VBD	Mood=Ind|Number=Sing|Person=3|Tense=Past|VerbForm=Fin	0	root	_	_
4	the	the	DET	DT	Definite=Def|PronType=Art	5	det	_	_
5	counsel	counsel	NOUN	NN	Number=Sing	3	obj	_	_
6	of	of	ADP	IN	_	9	case	_	_
7	the	the	DET	DT	Definite=Def|PronType=Art	9	det	_	_
8	old	old	ADJ	JJ	Degree=Pos	9	amod	_	_
9	men	man	NOUN	NNS	Number=Plur	5	nmod	_	_
10	which	which	PRON	WDT	PronType=Rel	13	obj	_	_
11	they	they	PRON	PRP	Case=Nom|Number=Plur|Person=3|PronType=Prs	13	nsubj	_	_
12	had	have	AUX	VBD	Mood=Ind|Number=Plur|Person=3|Tense=Past|VerbForm=Fin	13	aux	_	_
13	given	give	VERB	VBN	Tense=Past|VerbForm=Part	9	acl:relcl	_	_
14	him	he	PRON	PRP	Case=Acc|Gender=Masc|Number=Sing|Person=3|PronType=Prs	13	iobj	_	_
15	,	,	PUNCT	,	_	17	punct	_	_
16	and	and	CCONJ	CC	_	17	cc	_	_
17	took	take	VERB	VBD	Mood=Ind|Number=Sing|Person=3|Tense=Past|VerbForm=Fin	3	conj	_	_
18	counsel	counsel	NOUN	NN	Number=Sing	17	obj	_	_
19	with	with	ADP	IN	_	22	case	_	_
20	the	the	DET	DT	Definite=Def|PronType=Art	22	det	_	_
21	young	young	ADJ	JJ	Degree=Pos	22	amod	_	_
22	men	man	NOUN	NNS	Number=Plur	17	obl	_	_
23	that	that	PRON	WDT	PronType=Rel	25	nsubj:pass	_	_
24	were	be	AUX	VBD	Mood=Ind|Number=Plur|Person=3|Tense=Past|VerbForm=Fin	25	aux:pass	_	_
25	grown	grow	VERB	VBN	Tense=Past|VerbForm=Part|Voice=Pass	22	acl:relcl	_	_
26	up	up	ADP	RP	_	25	compound:prt	_	_
27	with	with	ADP	IN	_	28	case	_	_
28	him	he	PRON	PRP	Case=Acc|Gender=Masc|Number=Sing|Person=3|PronType=Prs	25	obl	_	_
29	,	,	PUNCT	,	_	31	punct	_	_
30	that	that	PRON	WDT	PronType=Rel	31	nsubj	_	_
31	stood	stand	VERB	VBD	Mood=Ind|Number=Sing|Person=3|Tense=Past|VerbForm=Fin	22	acl:relcl	_	_
32	before	before	ADP	IN	_	33	case	_	_
33	him	he	PRON	PRP	Case=Acc|Gender=Masc|Number=Sing|Person=3|PronType=Prs	31	obl	_	_
34	.	.	PUNCT	.	_	3	punct	_	_
```

## Pragmatics {#pragmatics}

<!-- sa -->
- form: statement
- act: assert
- voice: narrator
- polarity: none
- teacher: kept the draft

<!-- .fr -->
| # | verb | tense, mood | who | what, whom | to whom | where | when | other | roles by |
| --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- |
| 1 | **forsake** | past | father | the counsel of the old men |  |  |  |  | tree rules |
| 2 | **give** | past · perfect | men *= man* | the old men | father |  |  |  | vn give-13.1-1 «NP V NP-Dative NP»: agent=Agent he=Recipient which=Theme |
| 3 | **take** | past | father *not said here* | counsel |  |  |  | with the young men | vn bring-11.3 «NP V NP»: agent=Agent counsel=Theme |
| 4 | **grow up** | past · passive |  | the young men |  |  |  | with father | vn other\_cos-45.4 «NP V NP PP.instrument»: subject=Patient with he=Instrument |
| 5 | **stand** | past | the young men |  |  |  | before father |  | vn assuming\_position-50 «NP V PP.location»: agent=Agent before he=Location |

<!-- .note -->
One row per clause the reader finds. «not said here»: a role filled from the clause above. «roles by»: a VerbNet class and frame when one fits the verb, else the reader's rules on the tree.

## The Hebrew of this verse {#hebrew}

<!-- .vhe dir=rtl lang=hbo -->
וַֽיַּעֲזֹ֛ב אֶת־עֲצַ֥ת הַזְּקֵנִ֖ים אֲשֶׁ֣ר יְעָצֻ֑הוּ וַיִּוָּעַ֗ץ אֶת־הַיְלָדִים֙ אֲשֶׁ֣ר גָּדְל֣וּ אִתּ֔וֹ אֲשֶׁ֥ר הָעֹמְדִ֖ים לְפָנָֽיו׃

[1 Kings 12:8: the Hebrew tree, its pragmatics and Targum Jonathan →](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/1KI.12.8/)

<!-- div src -->

**Source.** The Holy Scriptures according to the Masoretic Text, Jewish Publication Society, 1917, from eBible.org: public domain. Sentence `jps:1KI:459` of Mova's parse database.

**The tree and the speech act** come from Mova's cycle: the small model's draft, read by a large model as teacher, passed by Mova's gates (Elamur Cosmic License). **The frames** are read from the tree by Mova's frames reader (`prag`) when this page is built, the chapter read in order, so a pronoun may be resolved from an earlier sentence of the chapter.

<!-- /div -->

<!-- pn -->
- ← previous: [1 Kings 12:7 (JPS)](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/jps/1KI.458/)
- next →: [1 Kings 12:9 (JPS)](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/jps/1KI.460/)
- ↑ back to [1 Kings 12:8](https://md.mova.elamur.ai/free/en/corpora/neviim/1KI.12.8/)